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Those comments he linked to did contain actual arguments. They also contained insults, which is unfortunate, but they were definitely not merely ad hominems.

I would not have problems with such comments directed at myself. As long as there are well written, structured arguments in there a insult won’t annoy me. Well, it probably will, but not very much.

I think it‘s also important to note that this is a controversial, highly emotional topic. I would expect it to get a little bit rough whenever that’s the case. The vast majority of comments on HN don’t contain insults or ad hominems.



I think that insults combined with actual arguments are worse than plain insults, because the latter are easy to ignore.

The only trolls that ever got to me were the ones that combined them.

Also, the guidelines are quite clear on shortening responses (http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html - bottom of frontpage):

> When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. E.g. "That is an idiotic thing to say; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3."


Insults are unfortunate. I thought I was quite clear on that?


I read you as saying that insults are unfortunate, but that insults + actual arguments are better than insults alone. Did you not mean that?

I was saying that insults + actual arguments are worse than insults alone.


I do think that insults with actual arguments are better than insults alone, yep.


I think the problem is that there are progressively fewer and fewer places where civil discourse is the norm. Many sites start out that way and establish a stimulating environment. As the site becomes popular and attracts a wider audience, civility and discourse are replaced by memes, ageism, misogyny, and sarcastic sniping. I think we've all seen it happen, on many sites. It gets old fast.




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